How to build an LP12

[Coyote Jim]

Has the deck been fettled or fuddled.
That should be making the Rega sound like a Dansette

[evil_C]

SO is the Achilles heel.
Switch it off and keep it analogue.

What he said ^^

[timster]

No need.

Bizarre but today it is performing perfectly. Only difference is I took the little shelf off (see pics above), so instead of sitting on wood with no isolation under the legs, it's on the proper rack. Could that make that much difference?

Anyway, no need to change SO. It's top notch today. I am a bit stuffed up from a horrendous cold but I can hear the improvement. Details, attack, depth

Playing Colour of Spring now, but first up was Willow empathogen as I know it so well. Just so happens it colour matched too!

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Both are sounding fabulous

[Andyt916]

No need.

Bizarre but today it is performing perfectly. Only difference is I took the little shelf off (see pics above), so instead of sitting on wood with no isolation under the legs, it's on the proper rack. Could that make that much difference?

Anyway, no need to change SO. It's top notch today. I am a bit stuffed up from a horrendous cold but I can hear the improvement. Details, attack, depth

Playing Colour of Spring now, but first up was Willow empathogen as I know it so well. Just so happens it colour matched too!



Both are sounding fabulous

[Mr Onion]

so instead of sitting on wood with no isolation under the legs, it's on the proper rack. Could that make that much difference?

Obviously the answer is a resounding YES.

Now let the motor, bearing and cartridge 'run in' before even thinking about changing anything else.

Motor ~50 hours
Bearing ~100-200 hours
Cartridge ~100 hours

(I left the TT running 24/7 to build up the motor and bearing hours, the cartridge is a different matter of course as it has to be playing some music)

[timster]

so instead of sitting on wood with no isolation under the legs, it's on the proper rack. Could that make that much difference?

Obviously the answer is a resounding YES.

Now let the motor, bearing and cartridge 'run in' before even thinking about changing anything else.

Motor ~50 hours
Bearing ~100-200 hours
Cartridge ~100 hours

(I left the TT running 24/7 to build up the motor and bearing hours, the cartridge is a different matter of course as it has to be playing some music)

Thank you for the suggestion. I'll keep it running over night!

Edit. Motor isn't new, but bearing is.

[timster]

Day Three

Humanahumanah...

Bloody good init?!

Still very surprised that that shelf made such a difference. Didn't affect the Rega to the same extent.
Without it and the LP12 has come alive.

It's lively, in a good way, and the definition is astounding. Plenty of oomph too.

[daveyf]

I just had my original Afro fluted plinth replaced by a new Oak braced model. As we know, the whole table has to be broken down and rebuilt to change out plinths ( we also added a new top plate and brace). So, knowing this, and that my local fettler had retired, i went to see Stan Zeiden at Shelley's in North LA. This meant a three to four hour drive each way through LA traffic, but it was very worthwhile, as the table not only looks fantastic, but sounds that way as well. It really pays to get an expert set-up on these tables, even if you think your local guy did an ok job.

[Mr Onion]

Still very surprised that that shelf made such a difference. Didn't affect the Rega to the same extent.
Without it and the LP12 has come alive.

Think of a turntable assembly as a vibration measuring instrument (which is what it is after all) and it starts to make sense.

The more better the instrument is at measuring vibrations the more sensitive it will be to its environment.

... and a rock solid surface is not necessarily better. Hit concrete with a hammer and the energy is put back into your arm. Hit a pillow and it is adsorbed. (not that I am suggesting that either is a perfect TT support, its merely an example0

[Coyote Jim]

IMG_4412.jpeg

[Bianconero]

There are also instruction.
Limited Edition!!!

[Coyote Jim]

IMG_1828.jpg

I did my Klimax LP12.

[akamatsu]

Day Three

Humanahumanah...

Bloody good init?!

Still very surprised that that shelf made such a difference. Didn't affect the Rega to the same extent.
Without it and the LP12 has come alive.

It's lively, in a good way, and the definition is astounding. Plenty of oomph too.

I went from a 7 ply Baltic birch shelf to a 16 ply Baltic birch shelf. It made a difference. There's much that can be done to the stand/rack to improve the sound.

[Tendaberry]

I went from a 7 ply Baltic birch shelf to a 16 ply Baltic birch shelf. It made a difference. There's much that can be done to the stand/rack to improve the sound.

I can only emphasize this

[ThomasOK]

OK, I've had about enough of "My 16 is better than your 7" stuff.

On a more serious note, I can't find 16 ply anywhere around here. It does look like one vendor will be able to get me a couple shelves in 11 ply. I'm looking forward to trying them out.

[Dan Steel]

Has the deck been fettled or fuddled.
That should be making the Rega sound like a Dansette

Nothing wrong with my Dansette Jim

[Moomintroll]

They were proper high end. My starter turntable was like this -

I can only remember having two 78s - a Russ Conway and Frankie Vaughan’s “ Green Door”

[El Exigente]

And why I'm now thinking of an LP12...

I may I suggest you also consider the Technics SL 1200. Fuss free, easy to set up and use, no long term upgrade expenses, etc. etc….

I've never found an LP12 hard to set up and use.

Upgrading from the Technics SL1200 to the SL1000R is every bit as expensive as upgrading a Majik LP12 to Klimax level. The only difference is the Technics can't be upgraded in stages.

Look at all the posts on Internet forums asking for recommendations for a good dealer to set up an LP 12. So while it might be true that you yourself do not have a problem with seting up an LP12, that is not universally the case. In contrast, the Technics only requires to be levelled before first use.

As as for upgrades, the point is that Technics doesn’t need them. The drive system is intrinsically that good. Look at HiFi News’ tests of the SL-1200s and the LP 12 to get a good sense of how the two stack up.

[El Exigente]

And why I'm now thinking of an LP12...

I may I suggest you also consider the Technics SL 1200. Fuss free, easy to set up and use, no long term upgrade expenses, etc. etc….

I own a Technics also; purchased in 1978...it's good...but it's not a LP12.

Well, that’s good in some ways .

I still have my SL-1300, bought new in 1976 for the princely sum of $125. Works just fine. My 1970s vintage LP12 is in pieces about to be listed for sale for parts. Back in the day, the 1300 more than held its own against the LP 12.

[Nestor Turton]

Technics decks are good value and ideal if you are unable to get the LP12 setup. Certainly, if I lost dealer support it’s a deck I’d consider swapping to. Technics SL1500G can be had for under £700 at some outlets and comes with a decent cartridge ready to rock. The SL1300G is around £2,800.

It does make me think why did I spend so much on the LP12, but I have it now and it sounds wonderful.

[daveyf]

Before owning a LP12 , I owned a direct drive Technics, While that player is a very good plug and play solution, IMHO, it really does not belong on the same playing field with a top-flite LP12. As one gets a more resolving system, the differences between the two become more evident, albeit as member Nestor noted, without a good 'fettler' available, the Technics option becomes more attractive, but if one has a the ability to access someone who can 'fettle', it becomes a simple choice...with the LP12 as the winner.

[Newton_John]

And why I'm now thinking of an LP12...

I may I suggest you also consider the Technics SL 1200. Fuss free, easy to set up and use, no long term upgrade expenses, etc. etc….

I've never found an LP12 hard to set up and use.

Upgrading from the Technics SL1200 to the SL1000R is every bit as expensive as upgrading a Majik LP12 to Klimax level. The only difference is the Technics can't be upgraded in stages.

Look at all the posts on Internet forums asking for recommendations for a good dealer to set up an LP 12. So while it might be true that you yourself do not have a problem with seting up an LP12, that is not universally the case. In contrast, the Technics only requires to be levelled before first use.

As as for upgrades, the point is that Technics doesn’t need them. The drive system is intrinsically that good. Look at HiFi News’ tests of the SL-1200s and the LP 12 to get a good sense of how the two stack up.

No turntable needs to be upgraded. But the option is there with an LP12 because it is modular. It isn't there with the SL-1200. To some that lack of flexibility is a disadvantage.

There is no single LP12 to stack up against the SL-1200. It is a very different type of product. I refer you to Daveyf's post above.

I only have experience of the UK, but I am aware of dealers here sending top spec LP12s all over the world. I doubt if it's worth going to that much trouble with the more basic models. Presumably, there are lots of other brands available in territories not covered by Linn dealerships. The SL-1200 certainly won't be the only other option, just as it isn't here in the UK.

[Nestor Turton]

There a quite a few decent turntables such as the Anna Log

[El Exigente]

And why I'm now thinking of an LP12...

I may I suggest you also consider the Technics SL 1200. Fuss free, easy to set up and use, no long term upgrade expenses, etc. etc….

I've never found an LP12 hard to set up and use.

Upgrading from the Technics SL1200 to the SL1000R is every bit as expensive as upgrading a Majik LP12 to Klimax level. The only difference is the Technics can't be upgraded in stages.

Look at all the posts on Internet forums asking for recommendations for a good dealer to set up an LP 12. So while it might be true that you yourself do not have a problem with seting up an LP12, that is not universally the case. In contrast, the Technics only requires to be levelled before first use.

As as for upgrades, the point is that Technics doesn’t need them. The drive system is intrinsically that good. Look at HiFi News’ tests of the SL-1200s and the LP 12 to get a good sense of how the two stack up.

No turntable needs to be upgraded. But the option is there with an LP12 because it is modular. It isn't there with the SL-1200. To some that lack of flexibility is a disadvantage.

There is no single LP12 to stack up against the SL-1200. It is a very different type of product. I refer you to Daveyf's post above.

I only have experience of the UK, but I am aware of dealers here sending top spec LP12s all over the world. I doubt if it's worth going to that much trouble with the more basic models. Presumably, there are lots of other brands available in territories not covered by Linn dealerships. The SL-1200 certainly won't be the only other option, just as it isn't here in the UK.

We don’t need to overthink this.

If a record player has a rock solid drive system and bearing (Technics),

and it has a solid mechanical structure (Technics) so that the entry level chassis does not need to be upgraded from a flimsy pressed steel item to something stiffer,

Then, what is the benefit of modularity?

The Technics arm can be changed, so an SME, or an Ekos could be installed, so the Technics is modular to that extent.

I will agree that the modularity of the LP 12 makes it easy to repair.

FWIW, I own three LP 12s, soon to be two, as one is going to my niece as a wedding present. So not a Linn brasher from the sidelines, just being realistic about the pros and cons.

[Newton_John]

So not a Linn brasher

Well, that’s exactly how you’re coming across. This is an LP12 forum and a thread originally started by someone seeking advice on putting an LP12 together, which he has now done. There’s plenty of other places online for the kind of “LP12 versus SL-1200” argument you’re looking for.