Balance problem with Akurate DS.

You mean there's more to HiFi than a LP12?

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Coyote Jim
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Re: Balance problem with Akurate DS.

Post by Coyote Jim » Mon Nov 04, 2019 6:52 pm

I would imagine perhaps a main dealer tweak or perhaps Class A in Sheffield.
Other than that hope you enjoy the upgrade. 8) :smt023
Turntable - LP12, Cirkus, Keel, Ekos SE/1, Kandid, K-Radikal, Urika.
Amplifier - Linn Majik I Integrated Dynamik.
CD Player - Linn Majik CD.
Speakers - Kudos X3.
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wiltshireman
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Re: Balance problem with Akurate DS.

Post by wiltshireman » Mon Nov 04, 2019 9:39 pm

WELL WELL WELL!!!!!!

Guess what I have just discovered? When I turned off space optimisation it cured it!!!! I have to admit that I have never really liked SO as it has always tamed my bass which I felt didn't need any taming but I am always happy to play and obviously the last time I did any adjustments I left it switched on. What appeared to be a very good central image with the Akurate pre has now become absolutely dead centre so I can only imagine things will have returned to normal with my own pre.

I feel an absolute twit I can tell you and I can only apologise for my own pidity and the only think I can offer in my defence is that I have been only playing simple ff and speech so as to concentrate on the central image and so had not noticed any lack of deep bass caused by the SO being switched on. There is one good thing that has come out of this, I am so much much wiser but still need an upgrade. Apologies once again.
Linn Keltik's, aktive LK100's x4, LP12, Simon Price oak plinth, Lingo3, black Ittok with silver heavy weight, Linn T arm cable, DV 20XII + Infinity and Cirkus bearing, Arcam Rphono + Russ Andrews power supply, Akurate DSII, Inneos Zen mini server. Loads of Chord cables.

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Coyote Jim
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Re: Balance problem with Akurate DS.

Post by Coyote Jim » Mon Nov 04, 2019 10:09 pm

Image
I never thought for a minute you had all that space optimisation ff going.
I know only too well how it kills everything.IMHO :oops:
That used to be what Graphic Equalisers were for. :roll:
Great result and now a budget for more tunes. :smt020
Win Win. 8) :smt023
Turntable - LP12, Cirkus, Keel, Ekos SE/1, Kandid, K-Radikal, Urika.
Amplifier - Linn Majik I Integrated Dynamik.
CD Player - Linn Majik CD.
Speakers - Kudos X3.
Cables - Linn Silvers & K200 Black.
Support - Target TT4.

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LD100
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Re: Balance problem with Akurate DS.

Post by LD100 » Tue Nov 05, 2019 2:34 am

wiltshireman wrote:
Mon Nov 04, 2019 9:39 pm
Apologies once again.
No need for any apologies, as our systems get more, shall we say...elaborate, there is always the chance of a switch or circuit being left on when it should be off. Or, visa versa. :D
Enjoy the music! :smt020
Image
Original 1978 Fluted Afromosia LP12, Ekos 2, Lyra Kleos SL and lots of other stuff from the 70's that still work fine.

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Re: Balance problem with Akurate DS.

Post by Scooter » Tue Nov 05, 2019 10:20 am

I never gave it a thought about SO but who set it up? If you go through the graphs you should be able to pick up the differences between the speaker settings.
"If you're not careful, the newspapers will have you hating the people who are being oppressed and loving the people who are doing the oppressing." -Malcolm X

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Re: Balance problem with Akurate DS.

Post by Mr Onion » Tue Nov 05, 2019 10:47 am

SO never even crossed my mind. Great that you have the solution though as:-

1) you can spend more time evaluating what pre you want to upgrade to

2) It now has a better SH value as its working correctly

Win/Win :smt023
James
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Fluted Afro LP12, Khan, KEEL, Cirkus, Tranquillity, Urika, Radikal (with Allium Skin Mods), EKOS SE/1, sKale, DVXX-2mkII
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Re: Balance problem with Akurate DS.

Post by wiltshireman » Tue Nov 05, 2019 11:15 pm

Hi All,
I didn't have anyone set up the sound optimisation in my room as I bought it secondhand after having a Maik DS for about a year but I am aware of the speaker selection on the DS of course and whether they are small or large on the Exotic. I have often played with the SO being very precise with my set up and any measurements so when my exact measurements are entered the result is always a massive reduction in bass performance. Now I realise that an excessive bass is not best practise but the one thing I dont have is a boomy bass when SO is switched off. I have tried exaggerating my room dimensions plus and minus but that has never improved things but I do revisit and play around with things trying to get SO to actually improve anything which IMHO it never has. I simply just didn't switch it off the last time I had a play and forgot it was on and that is why it was switched on.

My problem now is that the measurements I have entered are about as accurate as it is possible to enter, I am millimetre accurate and so too is the positioning of my speakers so why did SO ruin my dead centre position? I feel that it may reduce bass or what ever but it shouldn't have done what it did and now I am more than a little p..... off with having ripped my system to pieces and spending days trying to find a fault that didn't actually exist or did but shouldn't have .At least I am not now in any hurry to get another preamp and can sit and wait for the right one to come along which it will. I am listening to my Exotic and it is a good preamp but it is dated and things are better with the Akurate so thats my next move. My friend Steve from Bulgaria isn't able to come over this year now so the addition of two more amps is now on hold so thats about £100 already in the kitty so now only about another £1400 or so left to save up!
Linn Keltik's, aktive LK100's x4, LP12, Simon Price oak plinth, Lingo3, black Ittok with silver heavy weight, Linn T arm cable, DV 20XII + Infinity and Cirkus bearing, Arcam Rphono + Russ Andrews power supply, Akurate DSII, Inneos Zen mini server. Loads of Chord cables.

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Re: Balance problem with Akurate DS.

Post by Scooter » Wed Nov 06, 2019 7:34 pm

wiltshireman wrote:
Tue Nov 05, 2019 11:15 pm
Hi All,
I didn't have anyone set up the sound optimisation in my room as I bought it secondhand after having a Maik DS for about a year but I am aware of the speaker selection on the DS of course and whether they are small or large on the Exotic. I have often played with the SO being very precise with my set up and any measurements so when my exact measurements are entered the result is always a massive reduction in bass performance. Now I realise that an excessive bass is not best practise but the one thing I dont have is a boomy bass when SO is switched off. I have tried exaggerating my room dimensions plus and minus but that has never improved things but I do revisit and play around with things trying to get SO to actually improve anything which IMHO it never has. I simply just didn't switch it off the last time I had a play and forgot it was on and that is why it was switched on.

My problem now is that the measurements I have entered are about as accurate as it is possible to enter, I am millimetre accurate and so too is the positioning of my speakers so why did SO ruin my dead centre position? I feel that it may reduce bass or what ever but it shouldn't have done what it did and now I am more than a little p..... off with having ripped my system to pieces and spending days trying to find a fault that didn't actually exist or did but shouldn't have .At least I am not now in any hurry to get another preamp and can sit and wait for the right one to come along which it will. I am listening to my Exotic and it is a good preamp but it is dated and things are better with the Akurate so thats my next move. My friend Steve from Bulgaria isn't able to come over this year now so the addition of two more amps is now on hold so thats about £100 already in the kitty so now only about another £1400 or so left to save up!
I think the move to the Akurate pre-amp will be an improvement. I was fortunate enough to buy new so it was set up by my dealer. I would dread to have a go myself after watching him. It didn't help that the room is L shaped. It may well be worth paying a dealer to set SO up for you. It's also not about boosting or reducing bass etc, it's more about trimming the sound to the room. I had a problem with a pinging sound on pianos so I had to endure whilst it was tweaked in until the ping was banished. The loss of the Linn forum hasn't helped I feel you would have got better answer/explantion there. Maybe worth a mention on the wigwam site but it's now where near as good as the old Linn site.
"If you're not careful, the newspapers will have you hating the people who are being oppressed and loving the people who are doing the oppressing." -Malcolm X

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Re: Balance problem with Akurate DS.

Post by wiltshireman » Wed Nov 06, 2019 10:31 pm

Hi Scooter,
I know the Wigwam site isn't as good as the old one, I went there first and although I dip in occasionally I am not overly impressed and am not a member. Many of the past members are just not there but more importantly it doesn't have any of the old topics to learn from and as a past Naim owner (not LP12 of course just amps) I knew nothing of Linn ff and used the site to educate myself about Linn gear. Never did learn everything but when I had problems with Kabers and other ff could always find the answer. As to SO I think I will just leave it switched off. Its not like I have any problems with my room it all seems to be very happy but when you have something you can play around with and experiment with you do.

I fail to see how anyone can do more with any settings that would make things better. I have spent many hours and have never found much very positive to say about it. Interestingly my B in L has come to the same conclusion and has his switched off too. At the mo he is in Ozzy land but when he comes home I am going to see if his SO also affects his central image as well. As to SO in my system all it wants to do is take off the bottom frequencies and doesn't have much affect on anything else (part from my central image!).

The one positive thing it did when I first got a DS was to remove an upper room bass problem that I had. The bass stayed in the upper half of the room so the effect was that when you were sat down you had a lack of bass but when you stood up you entered the bass that you should have been hearing. A very odd effect I can tell you. Anyway it did improve things but after experimenting with speaker positioning I cured things and then after further playing realised that SO wasn't helping with other things so I just left it off and only dipped into it occasionally. Perhaps if you take note of all your settings so you cannot ever loose them you should set up another set of measurements and play around. You can always return to your dealers settings as and when you like. Have you ever just switched it off? It takes only a moment and you can always turn in back on. Thanks for your interest.
Linn Keltik's, aktive LK100's x4, LP12, Simon Price oak plinth, Lingo3, black Ittok with silver heavy weight, Linn T arm cable, DV 20XII + Infinity and Cirkus bearing, Arcam Rphono + Russ Andrews power supply, Akurate DSII, Inneos Zen mini server. Loads of Chord cables.

Scooter
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Re: Balance problem with Akurate DS.

Post by Scooter » Wed Nov 06, 2019 11:31 pm

wiltshireman wrote:
Wed Nov 06, 2019 10:31 pm
Hi Scooter,
I know the Wigwam site isn't as good as the old one, I went there first and although I dip in occasionally I am not overly impressed and am not a member. Many of the past members are just not there but more importantly it doesn't have any of the old topics to learn from and as a past Naim owner (not LP12 of course just amps) I knew nothing of Linn ff and used the site to educate myself about Linn gear. Never did learn everything but when I had problems with Kabers and other ff could always find the answer. As to SO I think I will just leave it switched off. Its not like I have any problems with my room it all seems to be very happy but when you have something you can play around with and experiment with you do.

I fail to see how anyone can do more with any settings that would make things better. I have spent many hours and have never found much very positive to say about it. Interestingly my B in L has come to the same conclusion and has his switched off too. At the mo he is in Ozzy land but when he comes home I am going to see if his SO also affects his central image as well. As to SO in my system all it wants to do is take off the bottom frequencies and doesn't have much affect on anything else (part from my central image!).

The one positive thing it did when I first got a DS was to remove an upper room bass problem that I had. The bass stayed in the upper half of the room so the effect was that when you were sat down you had a lack of bass but when you stood up you entered the bass that you should have been hearing. A very odd effect I can tell you. Anyway it did improve things but after experimenting with speaker positioning I cured things and then after further playing realised that SO wasn't helping with other things so I just left it off and only dipped into it occasionally. Perhaps if you take note of all your settings so you cannot ever loose them you should set up another set of measurements and play around. You can always return to your dealers settings as and when you like. Have you ever just switched it off? It takes only a moment and you can always turn in back on. Thanks for your interest.
I have switched it off and it does sound worse. The system was set up by my dealer which took some hours, he also came back two weeks later to revisit. Another thing he has done is save my settings into his storage. So if I lost them he would have them for me. There was a guy from Vancouver on the Linn forum who used to visit and set SO up and he got a lot of positive comments. I wouldn’t know where to start to change it and thankfully I’m more than happy how it sounds so for me it’s a case if it ain’t broke don’t try to fix it. Glad your sorted anyway and can get back to listening which is what it’s all about.
"If you're not careful, the newspapers will have you hating the people who are being oppressed and loving the people who are doing the oppressing." -Malcolm X

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