Roksan Hybrid Vs Linn Hybrid V Linn LP12

[Paul246]

Hi folks,
You know, it never ceases to amaze me that whilst tuning a turntable how far off piste you can wander. Playing the whole side of Pink Floyds "wish you were here" has shown me just how quickly the slightest thing can throw everything out. I should have paid attention to myself as I found I was changing mats to compensate, Goddamn!
Anyway, without the arm board bolt isolation, (which I did on a whim) whilst refitting the board, the lp is alive again, all of the tinkling notes are back at the beginning, they were there but not as defined or alive. The sound is more expansive and detail is lovely.
Fortunately I'm at a point now where I'm trying one thing at a time, so can backtrack pretty easily if I make a blunder, like I just did.

[petecallaghan]

Yes - it's easy to be mis-led so changing one thing at a time is the safest way

[Paul246]

Hi Peter,
I'm glad you're following this as it'll soon be playing and if you wouldn't mind listening to the changes that occur whilst tuning again, I'd be more than happy to supply files for you to give your opinion on. You can choose the tunes.
And yes, thank goodness I'm at a point with the Linn hybrid that now allows me the luxury of one change at a time. During set up I'm doing so many things all the time, usually just following my ears and gut, that I forget where I've got to and how I got there. Just my way of working I guess but can be really frustrating at times.
Thanks for reading and for your interest. Paul.

[Paul246]

Hi again,
The 8mm motor bolts have arrived so I've modified the bolt holes through the motor housing to take these for the moment and got everything where it needs to be, 8mm stainless threaded tube to hide the bolts on the motor. Still have to tidy all the filing up but need to make sure everything fits before that.
Pics of the motor mount and the 8mm alloy bar for the outward legs as the motor housing is too light as it is, but you can see how the motor height is climbing. The bolts are too long at the moment as I'm not sure how much to cut off them yet, and the support legs will bolt on to these and have adjustable feet to allow fine tuning of the height adjustment to make sure the belt runs in line.
I'm getting excited now as I've just procured another Roksan HDC 03 tone arm cable for this. I love those cables, they just sound great.
All the best and thanks for reading. Paul.

[Paul246]

Sorry 1st pic is the wrong one but you're not missing much.

[The Kaptain]

If you click the 'pencil' top right of your post you can edit and remove/add images should you wish

[Paul246]

Thanks Kaptain, I didn't realise I could do that. Amended it now. Thanks again. Paul.

[Paul246]

Ok Folks,
This is the initial motor set up, two legs forward with adjusters, two stainless 200 gram adjustable weights on the rear. Height is about ok, everything is clear of everything else. The motor is a bit down at the rear as one of the bolts I machined a point on as I nicked it from elsewhere before these others came, so needs swapping out to give a little more height. It all seems to be ok but I won't be able to do any more till I wire the motor in and get it running to see what needs fine adjusting. I'll do that later tonight if I get time.
Thanks for reading. Paul.

[petecallaghan]

Hi Peter,
I'm glad you're following this as it'll soon be playing and if you wouldn't mind listening to the changes that occur whilst tuning again, I'd be more than happy to supply files for you to give your opinion on. You can choose the tunes.
And yes, thank goodness I'm at a point with the Linn hybrid that now allows me the luxury of one change at a time. During set up I'm doing so many things all the time, usually just following my ears and gut, that I forget where I've got to and how I got there. Just my way of working I guess but can be really frustrating at times.
Thanks for reading and for your interest. Paul.

Yes definitely interested in hearing clips. Any track is fine.

[Paul246]

Thanks Peter,

Same track might give you some comparison to the Linn hybrid.

Anyway, it works, the motor turns at 33.3 rpm believe it or not, I just placed the motor with what I thought felt like the correct tension on the belt, I've just strobed it and it's bang on, that's a bonus!
So, before I get too involved, I'll get the motor housing tidied up a bit (need to take it to bits again for that) but if I don't do it now, it won't get done once I start with the sound.
I'm also waiting for the tone arm cable to arrive, I've got a couple around but may as well give this its best chance to go up against the Linn hybrid and Linn LP 12. In saying that if it doesn't arrive tomorrow, it'll be getting one of the others on it and tried anyway.
I'm not sure this will measure up to the other two to be honest, but may be surprised.
Best of all though, it's working and fed power via my now totally universal Vinyl passion box.
Here's hoping.

[Paul246]

Hi folks,
Well screw waiting till tomorrow for a cable, I stuck my old Linn one on it and had a listen.
Being very honest, it has no depth, it sounds tinny and cheap and what sound it does produce well, is mainly due to the arm and cartridge I would think, but even then those components are struggling with the acrylic platter.
This is even more pronounced when I switch back to the LInn hybrid as that just exacerbates the absolute lack of quality of sound from the Roksan hybrid, to be brutal it's s--t.
It looks like the way forward is fitting a LInn bearing and platter to this as I can't see a way forward from this starting point with this acrylic platter. I think the motor is ok and the chassis seems about the same as the LInn hybrid, but Hell on earth, there's a limit to what anyone could do with this, and that's exactly it, it definitely has it's limitations, whereas the Linn Hybrid and LP 12 can still go forward and improve from where they are now. they don't seem to have any limitations.
It'll be easy enough to change the bearing housing on this chassis, and I can have another go with the peak bearing as I thought that was going in the right direction (and still may trump the Circus), the motor housing will have to be rebuilt with a Linn motor as well.
In the meantime I may just try the Ittok on the Linn hybrid as I can just change the arm board now.
Ah well, another day another project.

[Mr Onion]

Remember, its all about the journey not the destination.

Its all knowledge

[Paul246]

Thanks James.
I do know that in my heart and I've really enjoyed the build, it's just a bit of a disappointment right now, and left me a bit down.
No doubt tomorrow I will see it afresh and as an opportunity to use the knowledge gained throughout, rather than what I'm feeling now.
Thanks for reading and for your interest. Paul.

[Nestor Turton]

Remember, its all about the journey not the destination.

Its all knowledge

Yes better to travel hopefully than to arrive.
That is an ambitious project indeed @Paul246 - hope you getting working the way you want.

[petecallaghan]

Although it's disappointing, if you're patient it could help you gain more understanding of how the different components impact the performance.

For example, can you change just the platter? Or do you have to keep platter/bearing/motor?

Maybe changing the chassis for a completely different material works better with the Roksan components.

[Paul246]

Hi folks,
Thanks for your support and suggestions, I appreciate the fact someone reads this and finds it interesting.
I'm over the disappointment this morning, although still retain the lack of completion of the project, tidying up the motor mount etc.
However, working with what I have and with my universal fitting standpoint or (modular construction), an opportunity for rescuing the project is always round the corner.
I'm going to change the bearing to a Linn mount and use the Peak bearing (as I have one handy), I can always change that for a Cirkus at a later date if needs be as the mount will be the same. If anyone has a Circus bearing with inner for sale, or a decent Linn motor, I'm your man.
A Linn motor will fit in the mount I already made with a few adjustments and then I can finally tidy it up.
Sorry the last project was a flop, but keep reading if your interested in how the rescue goes, I'm already on it.
Thanks again for your support/suggestions and interest. Paul.

[Paul246]

Here's a pic of the the first rescue package to convert to a Linn bearing.

[Paul246]

Hi folks,
Right then, here's the Linn main bearing mount, I just have to bolt it to the chassis but need to check the arm distance before that as I may need to move it slightly. There is a mm or two adjustment at the arm board end but I'd rather keep that spare, so I'll just make sure it fits together correctly before drilling the mounts.
Actually I've just dropped the arm board on and tried it, distance is pretty much spot on 211mm, so I'll get on with drilling the chassis to fit this.
This mount will take a Cirkus bearing as well.

[Paul246]

Bearing fixed in place

[Paul246]

Although it's disappointing, if you're patient it could help you gain more understanding of how the different components impact the performance.

For example, can you change just the platter? Or do you have to keep platter/bearing/motor?

Maybe changing the chassis for a completely different material works better with the Roksan components.

Hi Peter,
Yes, you are correct and I understand what you're saying about how differing materials react to each other, the acrylic platter would probably be better with a wooden chassis (like it was in), but I like the alloy as it suits my style of working better, it doesn't hide anything and so you have to physically tune it to deal with the resonances, but I find it also provides much more clarity and detail.
The acrylic platter was the spanner in the works with the Roksan (the bearing wasn't great either) and I just couldn't deal with how tinny it sounded with the alloy chassis and didn't see how I could make that combination work together.
I haven't scrapped the idea completely but to be honest after hearing the LInn LP12 and especially the LInn hybrid, I'm much more suited to them, or them to me. Given that I can still tune them further is the key, the Roksan would've taken a lot of work to get anywhere near either of them hence the quick decision to end that project.
Thanks for reading and for your input. Paul.

[Paul246]

Hi folks,
New development for the Linn Hybrid, I've just ordered a Krown Platter from Vinyl Passion, firstly I like the idea of stainless steel and alloy as it's in sync with everything else on that turntable, secondly I like the idea of more outer weight on the platter. Thirdly, I need another platter for this other hybrid, so I can just swap the one on the Linn Hybrid onto this without cannibalising the LInn LP 12.
Anyone got a decent Linn motor to sell?
All the best Paul.

[Coyote Jim]

Hi folks,
Anyone got a decent Linn motor to sell?
All the best Paul.

Hi Paul.
If looking to buy or sell then put a wanted or for sale in the emporium section.
Much more likely to get a bite than a comment in a post.
Some might just browse the topics.

[KEF Man]

Hi folks,
New development for the Linn Hybrid, I've just ordered a Krown Platter from Vinyl Passion, firstly I like the idea of stainless steel and alloy as it's in sync with everything else on that turntable, secondly I like the idea of more outer weight on the platter. Thirdly, I need another platter for this other hybrid, so I can just swap the one on the Linn Hybrid onto this without cannibalising the LInn LP 12.
Anyone got a decent Linn motor to sell?
All the best Paul.

Quite few used motors could be found here
https://lp12bits.com/collections/motors

[Paul246]

Hi folks,
New development for the Linn Hybrid, I've just ordered a Krown Platter from Vinyl Passion, firstly I like the idea of stainless steel and alloy as it's in sync with everything else on that turntable, secondly I like the idea of more outer weight on the platter. Thirdly, I need another platter for this other hybrid, so I can just swap the one on the Linn Hybrid onto this without cannibalising the LInn LP 12.
Anyone got a decent Linn motor to sell?
All the best Paul.

Quite few used motors could be found here
https://lp12bits.com/collections/motors

Thanks for the bite Kef Man, and for the link. Bought one.

[Paul246]

Hi folks,
Anyone got a decent Linn motor to sell?
All the best Paul.

Hi Paul.
If looking to buy or sell then put a wanted or for sale in the emporium section.
Much more likely to get a bite than a comment in a post.
Some might just browse the topics.

Will do in future Coyote Jim, fortunately I was lucky enough to get a bite anyway. Thanks for reading. Paul.